The “Law Abiding Gun Owner” (Dec 6)

Fact-Based Reporting

by Amanda Chen and Rob Roman

"Have you seen the like? Their walls are built of Cannonballs. Their motto is 'Don't Tread On Me'"
“Have you seen the like? Their walls are built of Cannonballs. Their motto is ‘Don’t Tread On Me'”


  • What would you do if a teen was playing music too loud or your brother was upset with you?
  • What would you do if an 8 year old neighbor was too rambunctious, your spouse wore shoes you didn’t like, or your tenant was late on the rent and parked in the wrong place?
  •  How about if you spotted a young teen trying to get into your home or if your friends stopped talking to you?
  • What would you do if a stranger knocks at your door or rolls up your driveway?

Well, if you were a “law abiding gun owner”, perhaps you would shoot them to death.

They started it, anyways.

These are all recent stories about people who became emotional, upset, impulsive or foolish and a firearm was used before they used their objective reasoning and their common sense. Many of these people enjoyed shooting firearms and they wanted to have a sense of freedom and protection.

We enjoy the right of our 2nd Amendment which allows us to keep and bear arms for self-defense and the defense of our families. But too many “law abiding gun owners” turn to their guns as a first resort, rather than a last resort, in the midst of everyday conflicts and stressful situations.

gun showkids with guns 3

Gun ownership is becoming more main stream and more and more people are buying weapons, going to firing ranges, and demanding to bring their guns with them everywhere they go. Even NRA board member Ted Nugent echoes the idea that “An armed society is a polite (civil) society”.

But a lack of skills in conflict resolution and a stubborn inability to see things from an objective point of view, coupled with a pervasive feeling that one is under attack and disrespected, too often leads to tragic and fatal consequences. Too many unarmed and often unsuspecting citizens are being shot to death by “law abiding gun owners”.

Allegedly will not be "Dunn" thinking about a better way to handle disputes for another 20 to 30 years
Allegedly will not be “Dunn” thinking about a better way to handle disputes for another 20 to 30 years

November 2012

Jordan Davis, deceased
Jordan Davis, deceased

Perhaps the best example of this is Brevard County Florida’s Michael Dunn, who is a life long gun enthusiast, gun collector and a frequenter of shooting ranges. Michael Dunn on the day after Thanksgiving, 2012, allegedly attended a wedding where he allegedly drank too much while allegedly grousing over the re-election of President Barak Obama with friends.

He proceeded to a gas station where he encountered three black teens playing loud music at the pumps. He ordered them to turn the music down and they allegedly had an argument. Mr. Dunn then allegedly pulled a weapon and fired 9 shots into the car full of teens, killing 17 year old high school student Jordan Davis. He then sped away and proceeded to allegedly enjoy a nice pizza dinner. Mr. Dunn’s trial is scheduled for February. He will claim that he was forced to defend himself from teens sitting in their car.

Here are some more recent events involving more or less stressful conflicts or negligence with an armed response and a tragic resolution.

The Victim Ronald Westbrook
The Victim Ronald Westbrook

November 2013

A Georgia man shot and killed a 72 year-old wandering Alzheimer’s patient who knocked on his door. The couple in the home had already called police, but the husband, Joe Hendrix, went out the back door with a gun and shot the man, Ronald Westbrook 4 times. No charges were filed.

The "suspect" Carrender will not need a calendar for some time....except for a court calendar
The “suspect” Carrender will not need a Calendar for some time….unless it’s a Court Calendar

October 2013

“Authorities have arrested an Indiana man who fatally shot his teenage son in front of his pregnant girlfriend in their Martinsville, Ind. home.

After arguing over whether or not to return home from the restaurant / bar where they were watching football games, David Carrender, 49, retrieved his handgun and shot Wyatt Carrender, 19, possibly six times, according to police”.

What could have been a better solution? Drive home during half-time. Okay, so it must have been in the 3rd or 4th quarter. Father knows best!

Many women have joined the rolls of law abiding gun owners, contributing to a “more polite society”. Now women have the freedom of security in their own homes and the liberty of being able to go unescorted where they want to go. They can carry a concealed power “equalizer” and no longer have to fear being mauled, attacked, robbed or raped by a strong, aggressive and opportunistic bad guy. But, is that all these ladies have to fear when packing the heat that affords them their new found freedom and liberty?


November 2013

A Florida woman, who had just had a heated argument with her boyfriend who had stormed out of her house, fired apparently through the door moments later when someone approached her home and started knocking loudly. That person happened to be her own daughter, Ruby, with her 4 month-old baby in her arms. Adele Bing shot her daughter, Ruby, dead by mistake.

Child safety advocate Ringhardt
Child safety advocate Ringhardt

October 2013

Melissa Ringhardt, 19, of Texas was babysitting a five year- old boy and his 6- month old sibling. She pulled her .40 caliber handgun out of her handbag and left it on the coffee table before taking a nap on the couch. She awoke to a gunshot and the 5 year-old was dead on the living room floor.

Women and children are safer, now that “inanimate objects” or “simple tools” are involved.

So, at least we have a polite society where spouses or lovers are nicer to each other and emotionally charged arguments are avoided because both partners own weapons. This causes them to be better communicators and ultimately more adept at peaceful and cooperative conflict resolution, right?

Problem solved. Domestic Tranquility.
Problem solved. Domestic Tranquility.

November 2013

A Tennessee man shot his wife after an argument over the husband wearing his wife’s deceased father’s shoes. James Cothran and his wife, Patricia, began arguing for over 30 minutes when after Thanksgiving dinner, Patricia asked James to take off her father’s shoes. He claims she then grabbed a knife and was “fixing coming at me, so I shot her”. James shot her dead with a .22 caliber handgun and he’s claiming self-defense.

I suppose in that 30 minutes of arguing, she never noticed that he had a gun on him. Alright then, Happy Thanksgiving!

Pretty in Pink?, No, Orange.
Pretty in Pink?, No, Orange.

November 2013

A Pennsylvania man was watching sports with his father and his brother when the two brothers got into a heated argument. Robert Bauduin,46, then blasted his brother Richard, 48, with a shotgun, killing him instantly.

Blame it on football and general sports violence inviting audience participation. What was the argument about again? They probably don’t remember.

And here’s an old headline from an old and true story about two brothers I worked with at a Stop & Shop Supermarket “Brother charged in shooting kin in theft of fifty cents”.

These two very large brothers both worked at the Supermarket for years and were always at each other’s throats. Then one day they had an argument at home and one brother blasted the other with a shotgun.

Since guns are just a simple tool, they also have an infinite variety of miscellaneous uses too. They are for much more than just making routine domestic arguments into fatal tragedies. An augmentation and enforcement mechanism for bible study seems to be one such use. Child discipline, animal control, and neighborhood protection are just a few more of the manifold uses of firearms.

Dispute Resolved. Peace restored to the neighborhood.
Dispute Resolved. Peace restored to the neighborhood.

September 2013

A white Texas man shot his neighbor, an 8 year old black boy, for being too rambunctious. The boy had just gone in his home to get a toy, and upon coming back outside, 46 year-old Brian Cloninger shot him in the face. “Maiden’s mother, Latamarin Locklin, recalled the aftermath of the shooting to KTVT on Thursday.

“When he ran in I just screamed,” she said. “His mouth was just hanging off and it was just a big hole… I just threw him on the couch and laid him in my arms and put pressure on his mouth with a towel.” When asked what happened, Cloninger was leaning against his truck and just said, “yes, I shot that kid”.

Maiden was bleeding profusely, but he was rushed to the hospital and underwent emergency surgery. He survived but was in critical condition.

Confronted by the dangers of 3 teens a car and a Remington rifle, the snake prevailed.
Confronted by the dangers of 3 teens a car and a Remington rifle, the snake prevailed.

September 2013

A Florida teen and his friends got out of his car and attempted to shoot a snake. Jared Hemphill, 18, shot his friend, Christopher Rape, also 18, in the leg instead. Upon recounting the story, the teen said they had to stop the car, get out and shoot the snake with a Remington semi-automatic rifle, as the snake in the road was a danger and a threat. Jared claimed self-defense. No charges were filed. The snake could not be reached for comment.

Dumas or Dumbass?
Dumas or Dumbass?

October 2013

A Tennessee mom was shocked when a man who was a friend of the family for three years, suddenly showed up and shot her son and daughter in their driveway. Angelique White, 29, and Christopher White, 23, were in the driveway when Aaron Dumas approached and pulled out a bible and started arguing with the siblings. While the mother was inside calling 911, she heard two gunshots. The siblings were hospitalized but survived.

You Talkin' to Me?
You Talkin’ to Me?

June 2013

New Orleans A man shot and killed a teen for attempting to rob his home. “A 14-year-old New Orleans boy was shot in the head early Friday morning after a homeowner said the unarmed teen was trying to break into his house.

Homeowner Merritt Landry, 33, who lives in Marigny, allegedly shot Marshall Coulter after fearing for his safety, and told friends and family he thought the teen had a gun.” Despite New Orleans’ “castle doctrine” laws, similar to Florida’s “stand your ground” laws, Landry was arrested and charged with 2nd degree murder.

Guns have been successfully used in law enforcement for centuries. When law enforcement falls short, the individual can reign supreme. Firearms also help business owners and home owners to “stand their ground” against people who are ‘fixing to violate the rules’ and ‘do trespassing and such’.

Obey the rules
Obey the rules

November 2013

A Tennessee bar owner shot and killed a patron for refusing to extinguish his cigarette “A downtown bar owner told police he fatally shot a country music singer in self-defense after the two got into an argument over the musician smoking a cigarette in a no-smoking area, authorities said.”

Pit and Barrel owner Chris Ferrell shot Wayne Mills, 44, around 5 a.m. Saturday, after the bar had closed, The Tennessean reported. Mills died at Vanderbilt University Medical Center.

Either he didn’t like the music or else I suspect there was a woman involved.

Let Freedom Ring
Let Freedom Ring

January 2013

A Georgia man shot and killed a young man who mistakenly pulled into his driveway because of a GPS error.

“Lilburn, Ga. – A 69 year-old suburban Atlanta man faces a murder charge after authorities say he shot and killed a 22-year-old man who had mistakenly driven into his driveway.

An arrest warrant states that Rodrigo Abad Diaz of Duluth, Ga., was fatally shot in the head Saturday as he tried to drive away from Phillip Sailors’ home in Lilburn, northeast of Atlanta.”

Sailors may have thought “the Guvmint was fixing to grab muh gunz”. After all, the far-right news media and talk shows had been barking this idiotic lie 24/7.

Here’s my personal favorite. In this situation, there was a discussion. The discussion turned into an argument whereupon the police were called. The police left thinking the dispute was settled. Then the homeowner / landlord got a firearm and charged in to do his own brand of law enforcement.

Pak was packing a lot of angry heat, but not much common sense.
Pak was packing a lot of angry heat, but not much common sense.

December 2012

The Deceased: Derrick Thompson and Alivia  Welch
The Deceased: Derrick Thompson and Alivia Welch

James Pak, 74, of Maine, shot and killed a young man and his girlfriend in the presence of the girl’s mother and 7 year-old son, after a dispute over late rent and not moving their car for the snowplow. Maine State Police identified the victims as Derrick Thompson, 19, and his girlfriend, Alivia Welch, 18. Thompson’s mother, Susan Johnson, 44, was treated for a gunshot wound at Maine Medical Center in Portland, where she was in stable condition early Sunday. Johnson’s 7-year-old son, Brayden, was not hurt. Problem solved. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

The point here, of course, is not that gun ownership is intrinsically bad or that the 2nd Amendment should be repealed. Gun ownership is an important part of our American history and culture. We should just remember that not every gun owner is thoughtful and deliberates carefully before they point and shoot. They will claim self-defense, apply the castle doctrine miles away from home, and continue to say “I was just cleaning my gun”.

The 2nd Amendment “no infringements” activists also are not always reasonable. They will claim that since it’s possible that ten people could invade the home of a law abiding citizen, there should be no limitations to the type of firearms that are available to individuals. They will claim that more people are killed by other means than firearms, so nothing should be done about gun safety until those other problems are fixed first.

They will claim that forks, knives and cars, things that everyone uses every day and multiple times per day, are just as dangerous as guns. They point to other related safety and control problems such as psychotropic drugs and mental health and claim that this is the problem, while guns are the innocent and “inanimate” bystander.

gun“Guns don’t kill people, people kill people”. Yes, so guns should not be regulated, but people like these folks should be regulated with respect to gun ownership and gun safety. Who is allowed to have or not have firearms and under what circumstances is always a legitimate subject to discuss.

US-CRIME-SHOOTING-POLITICSGun rights activists will claim that since the mass shooting tragedy called “Sandy Hook” and the subsequent gun safety and sensible gun control initiatives, gun sales have skyrocketed. That’s all the more reason why we need safety and control legislation. Protecting the public safety is one of the highest charges of government.

People are people and too many do not employ common sense, use appropriate cautions, and they try to resolve conflicts with deadly force as the very first resort. People are pulling out their lethal trump cards on impulse before exhausting every other option to resolve disputes.

kids with gunsThis is why all our children need lessons in how to behave in a civil society. For their own safety, they should have courses about how to resolve disputes and handle emotionally charged conflicts. They should know how and where to get help.

Gun safety training and continuing education courses should be mandatory for gun owners. Would institutions such as the NRA care to be involved in this endeavor?  They want to offer gun safety courses as a matter of individual choice, but just look at the deadly individual choices made in these examples.

Let’s have some courses on civil behavior and conflict resolution and some mandatory courses on gun safety. Can we do that?

Maybe gun rights activists will say our real problem is that not enough of us own and carry weapons. If everyone owned and carried weapons, then people would know everyone else is armed and people wouldn’t tangle with each other so much we could finally have a polite and civil society where there are no “knockout games”, no assaults, no mob violence, no beatings and rapes and very little random violence.

Firearms_SS-43461934We’re about half way there already, by the looks of theses news articles. Twelve dead and six wounded is a small price to pay for individual law and guideline enforcement, keeping animals in line, child safety, and domestic tranquility,

None of the victims in these stories were armed.

The snake, of course, has no arms.

What’s your opinion?

All comments are welcome and appreciated

All Rights Reserved


206 thoughts on “The “Law Abiding Gun Owner” (Dec 6)”

  1. Wow, that’s a very disturbing medley.
    To think this is but a few examples of what goes on everyday, and all recent incidents within a year.
    I’m not sure Ted Nugent has a particularly strong sense of irony, were he to read this article.
    Good article

    1. Thank-You. NRA types would say I am cherry picking the idiots with guns. They also say that gun suicides, gun accidents, and gun murders have all gone down over the last 20 years.

      This is no excuse not to have some safety requirements for guns.

      Yes, Ted said “an armed society is a polite society. Greta – because you are afraid if you mouth off, someone will blow your damn fool head off.

  2. Ps. Are those statistics reliable? I find it hard to believe that suicides, accidents and gun murders have declined over the last two decades. Given the constant increase in arming it defies logic.

    1. Yes, the statistics are correct and it is a valid point. Overall crime has declined as well. It has something to do with the crack epidemic. I have to look at it more.

      What’s happening now as far as gun sales going up, we won’t see the lethal effects of that for years.

  3. To properly assess this and draw any kind of meaningful conclusions one must know the source and context of those statistics.

    1. Acident Murder Suicide
      1993 .59 6.26 7.35
      2010 .20 2.84 6.27
      67% 55% 15% Reduction

      This is per 100,000 Source is CDC

      I checked it. 1993 WAS the high point, but there has been a steady decline. There are more older people now, that may be a factor.

      1. It is fundamentally unfair to take a peak period like the 90’s as a starting point and compare it to date, for one thing obviously it will show a decline and for another thing it’s a relatively short period of time (a generation) to show a trend. Let’s look at the trend starting in the 50s or the turn of the last century.

      2. It is a steady downward slope from the 90’s to now. I’m sure the explanation has nothing to do with more people owning guns, which is what they want you to think.

      3. I read an interesting study, from Wharton, here’s one of their fascinating conclusions:
        Increased insurance costs due to firearm violence in the US are probably
        of the same order of magnitude as medical costs, ($2.3 billion)
        increased cost of administering the criminal justice system, including incarceration costs ($2.4 billion)
        What do you say to that?

        Click to access sept04lemaire.pdf

      4. It’s just different than using a knife or a blunt instrument, because you point and shoot. You shoot someone at a physical and emotional distance.

        Also I love how “No infringement” gun people like to say there is no such thing as an “assault rifle”, when the AR-15 is a copy of the military M-16 which was specifically designed to kill as many people as possible as quickly as possible.

        Civilian open-carry people claim that hey, you never know in civilian life when you will suddenly be attacked by 5 to 50 people in your home or on the street.

      5. I just find it ironic that they’re all haggling over health insurance (one of the most important things in life) and these are the numbers: gun violence costs almost $5 billion. I also don’t buy the “if I’m allowed to own a gun then everyone’s safer” argument. How many people do you think were gun owners in that theater in Colorado? I bet quite a few. Did anyone draw and take the guy out?

      6. Guns were not allowed in the Aurora theater. But I get your point. The gun free zone argument doesn’t work because shooters want to kill and die and will still go, the guard or cop will be the first to get killed. Concealed carriers will selfishly protect their own, a handgun vs. a 100 round magazine and a shotgun and an AR-15?

        I am tired of well-dressed FOX guests, who have excellent health insurance for their own families, complaining every day about an attempt to get basic healthcare for people who don’t have or can’t get it.

      7. Ok I didn’t know no guns in the theater, though I doubt they have a metal detector and I also doubt if George Dirty Harry Zimmerman was there with his entire arsenal anything would have changed. He would have been the first one to dive under the nacho dispenser for cover. The same principle applies to other places that have no “no guns” restrictions, like Target for example.
        I was mugged and all along I had a can of pepper spray in my pocket. Do you think I used it? No. Was it because I was a coward or didn’t care about my stuff? No. I was too stunned to react. I can’t imagine someone shooting a semi automatic out of the blue.
        I’m with you 1000% on the Fox metrosexuals.

      8. 100% agree. I have stated here that the shooter always has the element of surprise. Not everyone can run into a stream of bullets to save others.

        And if the policy changes and people are conceal carrying everywhere, the killer still wants to kill and die. The shooter will change tactics and adapt. Using even further the element of surprise and superior firepower.

        Remember LA when 2 shooters with AKs held off dozens of armed police?

  4. Still, these are trends over two data points, relatively short period of time which could include blips, aberrations. It would be interesting to see the trend since the inception of the 2nd amendment. Of course to compare these stats to other nations would also show us how far we’ve come. There are a lot of demographic and other subtleties which have to be considered. I don’t think that more than 11,000 firearm homicides in a year can be considered a success by any stretch of the imagination.

    1. You have to compare all homicides with gun homicides to see what the proportion is. For example, we know the gun homicide rate is much lower in the UK, but what about the overall homicide rate.

      1. That’s what I’m saying, you have to compare and take into consideration a lot of things. To take the “peak” as a starting point and draw a (downward sloping) line from there, may be very convenient for the NRA lobby but it doesn’t tell us much, imo.

      2. But I saw the entire line. It is sloping downwards all the way. I really think there are other reasons for this. One idea is that the shootings in the cities are down, but they are up in the suburbs, etc. There are so many factors.

  5. I thought there was irony meant with the peaceful philosophy backdrop vs the subject at hand.
    What I really like about your article is that you address the fact that this is an issue of “law abiding citizens” with their legal arms. This is really important, I think, because the whole discussion about gun control tends to evolve around keeping guns out of the hands of criminals and lunatics.
    The problem is, as evidenced in your piece, that most of these people are not considered mentally ill by contemporary standards and a majority of them lead “normal” lives with no sign of insanity, they’re not walking around twitching and talking to themselves. Certainly most are not diagnosed until a violent incident and even then they can’t claim insanity in court as a defense. I think that most mentally handicapped and ill people are harmless and even victims of society sometimes. The guy who shoots an eight year old in the face, his elevator doesn’t go to the top floor imo, but I bet he hasn’t been diagnosed and will not be now. If you look at the Virginia Tech shooter, he had some history, he wrote some dark essays and was even reported I believe, but it’s hard to make the leap that he will shoot up the school from that. If we did make leaps like that Kafka would have been incarcerated his whole adult life. The main point is that it’s impossible to separate the lunatics and the potential lunatics (guys who lead a hum drum life and one day snap) and even if it were, there are lots of people we consider “normal” who do this kind of crap. I don’t think a course in conflict resolution would help much. There is a lot of deep seated anger, rage even, in some people and it is difficult (impossible even) to identify it until it’s too late.

    1. I absolutely agree with your point. The rage switch is sometimes undetectable.

      This whole site is about cultural evolution. The Chinese have 25 centuries of culture, we have Bonanza and Gunsmoke!

      I think most of these people in the article truly believed that they were “right”, and that being right gave them the excuse to use deadly force.

      The mother who shot her own daughter. The man who shot the Alzheimer’s patient and the man who shot the 14 year-old boy, The man who shot the guy coming up his driveway. They all didn’t hesitate to learn more about what was happening, they just open-fired.

      They ruined their own lives and the lives of others because they reacted before thinking. This is the problem of the gun.

      1. Well we do have Bonanza, true, but let’s not go overboard, the Chinese have enough blood on their hands as well, animal and human. I get what you’re saying but let’s not be too hard on ourselves. I agree though

      2. They are much better at communicating, cooperating, helping others, and solving problems peacefully.

        Here, I am talking more about interpersonal relationships than government. Many Chinese people are not happy with their govt.

  6. I don’t dispute the line/trend is downward sloping all the way, IFF you take 1993 as your starting point. I’m saying that’s very convenient. Do you think the gun nuts would choose to analyze the last TWENTY years if the peak of violence was in 1960 or 2005? No, they would choose a different interval, it’s propaganda. Two decades, coincidently starting the year of the worst violence in history, is too short to draw conclusions. Precisely as you’ve said, there may be other factors affecting these numbers and next year or the year after we may have a new spike. It is too short an interval, with a convenient starting date, to draw meaningful conclusions on trends. This is merely a short-term trend, possibly an aberration. Let’s look at the stats starting in 1900 to date. Let’s see the shape of that curve. In statistics it is always true that the more observations you have the more reliable your conclusions, the more statistical significance.

    1. Yes, I agree. 1993 is the peak and I knew they started there for a reason. But it is not a spike. There is a continuous decline.

      It’s better to have a longer range, but also better to look at a shorter range, like the last 10 years. 2000 to 2010, because then there are less variables.

      1. Rate of Gun Homicide per 100,000 People
        Chart In the United States, the annual rate of firearm homicide per 100,000 population is

        2011: 3.61
        2010: 3.59
        2009: 3.75
        2008: 4.01
        2007: 4.19
        2006: 4.29
        2005: 4.18
        2004: 3.97
        2003: 4.11
        2002: 4.11
        2001: 3.98
        2000: 3.84
        1999: 3.88
        1998: 3.37
        1993: 7.07

        Maybe a better word would be an apex if you don’t like spike. If you will note the gun homicides in 1993 are 7.07 (per 100000) that’s the apex, and in 1998 it’s 3.37 which is lower than in 2011 etc. In the years/decades leading up to 1993, gun homicides were lower but increasing. Short term numbers are useful but not to draw conclusions about any meaningful trends. The NRA doesn’t want us to know that because the short term data is convenient for their argument. This may change at any moment and then there will be quiet on the western front.
        It is very important to note that the Brady Bill was passed in 1993 and went into effect in early 94. Although it was challenged (by guess who) and the Supreme Court ended up ruling parts of it unconstitutional in 97, many parts of it continued to be implemented by state and local officials. I find it particularly paradoxical that the NRA’s claim that more guns mean less gun homicides is made by precisely the party who was the main opponent to the Brady Bill which is much more likely to be the culprit in the decreasing gun homicide rate in the last twenty years. Is it a coincidence the year of the bill?

      2. Fabulous work!! I looked at the graph and it did not look like that. Well, I am happy that this data from the No infringement fringe is not so great.

        I wonder what the NRA’s excuse was in 1993?

        Let me guess, Not enough goofballs with guns?

  7. The NRA argued that the Brady Act was unconstitutional because its provisions requiring local law enforcement officers to conduct background checks was a violation of the 10th Amendment to the Constitution.

    1. ps. Yes, essentially not enough goofballs with guns.
      BUT: the overall Brady statute was upheld and state and local law enforcement officials remained “free” to conduct background checks if they so chose.

      1. Yes, it is counterintuitive that more guns = less gun homicides and gun accidents, particularly when many gun accidents and deaths are at home with no “intruders”.

      1. More guns less gun deaths does defy logic, until you look behind the curtain. It’s not just the number now, it’s the “who owns the guns” – exactly- the background checks. Now we’ve got more gun owners (which I’m still not happy about but ok) but they are better quality now, according to the FBI stats something like 56% of rejects are felons and 15% are fugitives. It’s a well known fact that law enforcement is generally pro gun control, so if after 1997 (after the NRA Supreme Court Challenge) they were still “free” to conduct check I think they were doing them. So the Brady Bill was a major turning point which explains the downward slope since 1993 and goes exactly to your point: Universal background check, that’s going to have to happen.

      2. I think that is the best safety measure for both mass shootings and general gun violence.

        I still feel that high capacity magazines need more restrictions because high capacity is the reason 26 were killed in Newtown and 12 killed 72 shot in Aurora.

        Also, 6 kids at Sandy Hook survived because one kid told the others to run when Adam Lanza was changing out his magazine.

      3. I see absolutely no reason anyone should need or be allowed to own a high capacity magazine weapon. I have not heard even a half sane argument for that, ever. I think those things should be banned completely and immediately. Dave Hall will just have to find something else to hunt with.

      4. LOL. We need to be like Andy Taylor was with Deputy Barney Fife. Just one bullet.

        Yes, the cliff diver was at night. Yes, they found a black blindfold at the bottom. They would have to prove to me that it was an actual blindfold.

        Based on what I heard yesterday. I am now ready to make a prediction. She will be found guilty of 2nd degree and she will get 30 years.

      5. So you don’t think it was self defense, no way no how?
        The blindfold was not admitted into evidence as far as I know.
        So what did you hear that swung you this way?

      6. She called 3 friends and her father-in-law telling them they could not do this-or-that because she had a “surprise” planned for her new hubby

        “Pinyayata at the Precipice”. Apparently, a large amount of candy and a baseball bat were also found at the bottom.

      1. Did they find an apple at the bottom of the cliff too?
        Maybe if they both spent more time at the library none of this would have happened.

  8. LMAO, he was “hallucinating” ?
    I think this was the same interpreter who must of been working when Ahmadinejad said he wanted to wipe Israel off the map.
    It’s a movie with Helen Mirren (1989). They cooked and served up her lover in a restaurant.

      1. You should look up what he actually said, it’s not what we’ve been told at all. It’s not that I’m a big fan but fair is fair.

      2. It’s not that I’d like to be married to him or even live in his country but if you listen to him on C-span for example you get a different flavor than when you get our esteemed media’s interpretation of what he’s about.

  9. Obviously the massive security apparatus didn’t notice. He got paid 85 bucks and the company that provided him “vanished into thin air”. Nope, no clues there.
    Now the NSA runs the most massive spy program in history and they can’t prevent DC party crashers and schizophrenic interpreters?
    Watching this guy in action is better than Benny Hill.

  10. LOL, I feel sorry for him, he’s ill and they’re all coming down on him like a ton of bricks.
    What’s the big deal, the deaf didn’t know what was going on, neither did the thousands of hearing people in the stadium because their audio system was on the fritz. Mandela is dead, the time to pay respect to him was while he was alive.

      1. Here is a question for you, who in charge hires a guy for $85 to do interpretation for a historic memorial which will be flashed around the globe? The waiters got paid more.

      2. All I know is that the Brits are like the Germans, they’re all over the place. The Germans would have been quite comfortable with this interpreter, I think, he was doing a lot of what seemed like saluting to me….

      3. I have no idea what he was saying, I have no idea what a guy who actually knows sign language is saying. But take a look, it looked like he was doing a lot of saluting, maybe that means something in Swahili, like “he was a swell guy”??

  11. I don’t think he was running a scam. Does 85 bucks sound like a big scam to you? I think he’s mentally ill, he, like the hearing impaired, has a handicap. It can’t be easy to living with schizophrenia, it’s probably more difficult than being deaf. I think he’s ill but harmless but THEY are the idiots. Just goes to show what all this security, spying and war on terrorism is good for, it’s useless, the governments are useless. Ps. He already did a gig for Zuma last year apparently, so that should give you an idea what a bumbling bunch of idiots they all are.

      1. In their defense, they were busy messing up Latin America and training Bin Laden, that’s a full time job.

      2. Yeah, his answer was to do a completely illegal assassination, on foreign soil, so he could be a hero. No trial, no questions asked, just shoot the guy who you trained in the first place and who was probably quite impotent at this point anyway. Meanwhile, American kids are still in Afghanistan and Iraq getting their butts shot off. Way to go, more good will around the world for the US

  12. I would like Ron Paul, Denis Kucinich, Ralph Nader, Jesse Ventura and Willie Nelson to form a party and take over. A woman in there would be good too, but can’t think of one at the moment, maybe Gloria Steinem. Then you’d see some changes.

      1. The crack queen/Un ambassador ? She’d be more suited as an adviser to Rob Ford. Maybe they could get some tats together and that vial of blood could come in handy next time Ford has to take a blood test (though if it’s Billy Bob Thornton’s blood that might defeat the purpose)…

      2. You won’t be hearing anymore TomKat, that’s finito. Brangelina, well let’s see how long before she spots someone who’s in a committed relationship who she just must have…

      3. Yeah I know, you’re right, it’s like dumb blonde jokes or the N word, it must come from the right source LOL . Generally I don’t like the word much, but when the gonad fits…
        She said it because Jenifer Aniston is her friend, though she denies this.

      4. As Chablis would say: Keep Up!
        You gotta get off the Fox train and get a bit of RadarOnline or National Enquirer in yah

      5. OMG, did she just take a plea? So much for our “naive Mormon girl” accident theory.
        Is it my imagination or does it seem like the Mormons have a high per capita “get rid of your loved one” plans?

      6. Divorce or annulment just ain’t in the cards for followers of new Jesus. Maybe if they die they get “unsealed” and she doesn’t have to be with him in KOLOB for ever and a day.

      7. Right, of course Joseph Smith wasn’t a proponent of divorce, why would he be? He just kept piling on the wives

      8. You need to know? Are thinking of converting?
        Well now we know why they charged her with both first and second degree murder don’t we.

      9. It’s just like I said. He stuck it to her and she didn’t like it. Confirmed by Nancy Grace.

        Did you hear about the guy in SC who refused to lower the flag for Nelson Mandela?

      10. Yes, that’s another stupid story. I mean really, choose your fights. Watch, this will become an international incident, like we don’t have enough serious problems.

      11. To him, it’s serious. UH dun lower no ‘merican flag to no damn black communistical.

        It’s not international. It’s about defying a Presidential order.

      12. I just think they charged her with 1st and 2nd so they could coerce her into a guilty plea. I don’t think that’s ethical but any stretch. I guess that’s how in excess of 90% or criminal cases are pleaded out. That’s very economical but is it fair?

      13. That’s the way it’s done. Lesser included offenses. I believe if the prosecution charges 1sr degree, then that ‘s what they believe they have.

        I mean she gave the man an unauthorized flight lesson. If it was an accident, I think she would have fessed up, don’t you?

      14. Ok but then they shouldn’t have charged her with second if they believe they have first. That’s like insurance. Like Martinez saying the shot was last but just in case it wasn’t….
        In my opinion, the two charges are inconsistent, contradictory and mutually exclusive. Lesser can include lying to the police, no problem, but second degree as a backup for first? What she actually did or claimed we don’t really know because all the info we get is severely filtered and often plain wrong. I understand she admitted pushing him but said it was an altercation, that sounds like either an accident or 2nd degree. I don’t think it was planned and have a hard time with Zimmerman was standing his ground but it’s out of the question she was. I don’t have enough on her because I didn’t watch the trial and take everything that’s reported with a grain of salt. I’m not saying she’s innocent but the tactics here are dirty as usual.

      15. I think it’s because the jury decides what the facts are and apply it to the law. So they are give the lesser includeds and it’s up to them. I don’t see so much of a problem with that.

        I think there is something there to say 1st degree. It WAS at night. It is crazy. I see a pattern here of naïve Mormon women and Mormon young men who are selfish and have Zero feelings for anyone but themselves.

      16. I don’t have as much of a problem with the night thing. It could have still of been like a romantic plan in the evening that turned into a fight?? My biggest problem is that she left him at the bottom of the cliff, she should have called 911. So you have a point

      17. No question she was enraged. How old is she? Close to 30 when if you’re a Mormon it’s like Logan’s Run, you turn into a pumpkin if your not married. Maybe it was an arranged marriage. These people are in a class by themselves.

      18. There goes my theory. If she was unhappy, she could have just taken off.

        I don’t get it. Usually you need to be married 10 years before you want to throw them off a cliff.

        I wonder if their wedding theme was I Believe I Can Fly?

      1. Perfect, another pseudo-intellectual do-gooder, they are made for each other, though they will find it a bit too warm where they’re going….

      2. Jolie, who has a history of doing this, had an affair with him during the making of Mr. & Mrs. Smith, while he was married to Aniston. They both denied this though shortly afterwords got together and you know the rest.
        Laura Dern, who was engaged to Billy Bob Thornton (another prize) has said that she had a fiancee, left the house one day and read in the papers that he got married to Jolie, she never heard from him again. There are rumors she seduced a boyfriend of her mother’s when she was sixteen. She has some serious issues, which if my father was Jon Voit I’d have too, but let’s not pretend she’s Mother Theresa. She was a hard core addict and a couple of years later she’s the star of UN? There are people working in the field doing serious work with absolutely no propaganda or recognition, then she blows in like she’s devoted to the cause, pleeeease. She has no moral compass and is doing this to neutralize the negative image she’s racked up over the years. Same with all these high profile adoptions. And I don’t care how big her lips are.

      3. No, I didn’t use the C word on anyone, yet, but I’ve felt like it on numerous occasions. How about you, don’t you ever feel like letting’er rip?

      4. Interesting fetish. Go to a mud wrestling match or Walmart on a Black Friday, you’ll get plenty of exquisite.

      5. Lots of great things about our culture: we’ve got Halloween, The Jersey Shore, Ted Haggard and the Presidential Turkey Pardon, now who else can say that?

      6. Nancy was screaming that the cliff girl got off too easy and she is trying to claim that she has made a “sweetheart deal” to get less than a year.

        I think she’ll get 20 years. 10 years less for pleading.

      7. I hope I hope Nancy G kills her hubby. Then let’s see how pro-prosecution she would be.

        I have a friend who has a group where they are trying to prove JA had zero to do with TA’s death! OK, just ignore the facts, logic, deductive reasoning, the evidence, and Jodi’s own word. Grrrrrr

        I can’t stand it, but I don’t know if I should say something or just let it go?

      8. Maybe you’re a lousy boyfriend, Valentine’s should have been her favorite holiday LOL!
        Must be tough living with a vampire, you can’t order garlic bread at Sizzler.

      9. I’m an idiot, sorry I was thinking GUMP lol, my bad
        I think it’s cause there threads are all over the place, I can’t read or write right LOL

      10. Hmmm, Natural Born Killers, fascination with death, how do you approach a subject like say breaking up, with someone with these interests?

      11. Should you say something? Just sit back and see what they come up with, you never know. This is the problem with extremists, of any kind, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

      12. They will come up with their heads up their ass, that’s what they’ll come up with. Yes, that’s a very good point. This is Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis, yet nothing in this country works that way, wobble wobble.

      13. Priesthood? Heads up their ass? LMAO
        I guess you think your friend and your ex don’t read your websites then, Father Rob?

    1. Halloween is great but if you’re talking culture it doesn’t really compare to say the Bolshoi Ballet. I think the Turkey pardon’s great too, I just think they should give to all the turkeys, like a general amnesty.

      1. Well on a serious note, I think there are lots of great things about our culture.
        ps. I wasn’t attacking your Halloween
        pps. I think it’s because of Garp I could never take the Da Vinci Code seriously

      2. Oh, you lost me. What is the connection between Garp and the Da Vinci Code?

        I loved Halloween when I was younger. I think very strange people claim it’s their favorite holiday, like my ex gf who believed she was a vampire. I didn’t like Rocky Horror picture show either.

  13. Here’s your laugh of the day (on the subject of the Kenyan):

    Can I have a clozzzup, a clozzeup, sir a clozzeup! Sir, can I have a clozzeup!!!
    One thing I will say is they have interesting hairdressers on the looney farm….

      1. Ok, maybe, but the hair is all over his body I hear and I wanna see DNA and a certificate of live birth, and not from a Zoo

      2. I want the long form. I don’t think he’s a real American. I won’t lower the flag for him, no matter what. He’s most likely a communist, a
        Zionist, or a ventriloquist.

      1. Or a good shot of Thorazine in the ass….
        Your next article: Universal background check for heavy machinery

      2. Of course, the gun worshippers have all jumped on the story about Friday’s Arapahoe High School Shooting by saying the armed Resource Officer saved the day!!

        Actually, this shooter was going after one specific teacher. The Resource Officer stopped nothing.

      3. Classic perverted logic. I understand the attack took all of 80 seconds, it was the attacker who shot himself (before the resource officer even knew what the hell was going on) so the attacker himself saved the day (thank God for small favors) as paradoxical as that is. Now explain to me please how is it possible that in this state you can own a pump action shotgun at 18 but you have to wait for a handgun till you reach 21. What is the purpose of that? I would ban ALL this shit immediately. If you want to go bowling you have to go to a bowling alley, if you want to go shooting you have to go to a shooting range (or preferably the Gobi desert). None of this will change until the NRA president himself is shot in the head/ass (same thing).

      4. WOW – strong retort!!

        This gun free zone = murder magnet is a big crock. Shooters will still go even if everyone has a gun. Resource Officers would be the first target.

        Now, today, here comes another dipstick with the old knife / fork / bathtub / car argument (how these are just as dangerous)

        The other argument is look at all the police officers shot dead. Well then, there goes the stupid gun free zone argument, doesn’t it?

      5. Well the dipstick may have a point about bathtubs, IFF you’re a Mormon wife they can be just as dangerous. Otherwise, I suppose they have studies to show that gun free zones have higher incidence of shootings right?
        The police officers point is dead on. Was Fort Hood a gun free zone?

      6. Yes, Fort Hood was gun free inside the buildings. But the largest point is that in reality, this makes no sense. The killing is over and done before anyone can react.

        People will not go rushing into a Sandy Hook type scene with a pistol to heroically and selflessly save people, because these are the same people who are saying “we don’t care” about what happened at Sandy Hook, etc.

  14. Even if they cared they would not go rushing in. Even the SWAT team doesn’t storm a place without tossing in some tear gas first. It’s not Die Hard.

    1. Exactly, what a foolish argument to think the people who do not care about what happened at Sandy Hook, etc. will be the heroes that save the innocent strangers! I don’t think so!

  15. The one I love the best is the one about the right to bear arms is actually designed to prevent government tyranny. Meanwhile, everyone’s glued to their flat screens keeping up with the Kardashians and no one in the country has any idea what their government is actually up to. Everyone’s armed to the teeth but too busy to notice the tyranny has been well underway for quite some time. You’ve got your gun but they’ve got the element of surprise

      1. I’d like to see Ted Nugent defending his castle with a drone up his butt.
        Gratuitous trivia:
        Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie are also supporters of the Second Amendment. Pitt has stated that he grew up around guns and only feels safe when there is a gun in his home. Jolie claims that she fell in love with the guns she used in the “Tomb Raider” movies, and since then has purchased nearly every gun she has used in her films. The two of them have built a massive private shooting range in the backyard of their home. I wonder if the plethora of kids they have are allowed in the back yard?

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